The problems that the show encountered weren’t standalone versus mythology. Basically the show didn’t really get off the ground because the network pretty much wanted to back away from the concept five minutes after they bought it and then ultimately, the show itself is also kind of odd and difficult to market. I actually think they did a good job, but it’s just not a slam-dunk concept. It wasn’t like our numbers were huge and plummeted. They were tiny and still somehow managed to plummet. We alienated both our viewers. - Joss Whedon on Dollhouse.
I could write a lot just about the paragraph above and not say it nearly as well as he said it. Joss actually had a bit more to say and the stuff about FOX backing away from the concept (due to the sexual/exploitation/fantasy) elements were particularly interesting. As ever, Whedon handled himself with grace and good humor. I recommend reading Mo Ryan's feature and the full interview with Whedon.
Dollhouse returns tonight with two episodes at 8pm. It will also air two episodes from 8p-10p on December 11 and December 18, before taking a break and then airing its final three episodes on January 8, January 15, and January 22.
6 new episodes in 3 weeks hmm
Can Joss just say that he hates Fox, so they won’t ask him for anything ever again?
Tdot, nothing to make you go hmmmm here. That’s been the planned schedule ever since they announced the cancellation officially back on 11/11.
Personally? I think it’s time for Joss to find funding elsewhere. Network TV doesn’t actually _like_ his work. I doubt Broadway, but a SciFi Channel thing, maybe? The regular networks are out of it.
Remember; this *is* the place that Firefly was dearly loved, and yanked away. I think it’s time Joss said his peace, and be on his merry.
I think Dollhouse actully has higher chance of survival if Fox aired the original pilot instead of airing the reshot pilot.
The original one is a lot beter than the new one…….
this was a very interesting, insightful article/interview. on that note, can we have a Dollhouse ratings prediction post for tonight’s episode??? I doubt it, but it’d be funny if Dollhouse rebounds. I know ratings don’t matter anymore but I predict a 1.2 average with 2.5m viewers
I don’t know, I saw the original pilot and I have to agree w/ Fox, that it needed a reshoot if Joss had any chance of getting regular viewers, and he obviously needed a little direction, since the first 6 that Fox helped guide him with were the ones that got the higher ratings, I watched the show all season, and this year as well, I would say the only mistake Fox made (if they realy wanted success) was not airing the season #1 finale(it was good and kinda explained the show better than anything shown to viewers.
The show had so many logic problem tha it wasn’t even funny, even fans had a hard time telling you why it was good other than (Joss wheadon, eliza must get support no matter what).
If wegot 2 seasons which is amazing, and maybe the show is cheap enouth for a 3rd straight-to-DVD FX cable run…hey I would never of predicted a year 2
Yeah good interview. Whedon says this will be the end of Dollhouse in any form (movie, comic book, etc) so they aren’t saving anything and will be going out with a bang. I am VERY excited for these last episodes.
I thought the original pilot was better than the first five (aired) episodes myself. But then I thought it was better than Epitaph One, which seems to be wildly popular for reasons I don’t quite understand.
I don’t think Fox was “wrong” in what they did, I think the Dollhouse team just found it hard to put together decent episodes. And while the swivel-eyed mob who thought the show promoted evil were loud, I don’t think the premise was what turned people off, I just think that too many episodes were bad TV. I think the numbers would have been somewhat different if season one had been the Original Pilot, S1E6-S1E12, S2E1, S2E3 and S2E4.
Ah well. Too late now. It’d be nice if Whedon learned from this, I’m not sure given the interview he’s taking home the right lessons.
Thats a great article.
This was a great article. I like how he said “we actually didn’t wint he strike”. Thanks for posting!
yep dollhouse is coming back tonight!!! cant wait..
Joss should make more sci fi movies.
Serenity was awesome.
** as was Doctor Horrible.
Whedon may not be in denial about the ratings (I doubt even Glenn Beck could muster that level of denial), but he’s still in denial over the show itself. It wasn’t always awful, but it was never very good. And it wasn’t just FOX that had a problem with the ‘cuddly whoremongers’ angle–his own diehard fanbase frequently had problems with it as well. Even on Whedonesque, a lot of people have been quietly rooting for Dollhouse to end, so Joss can get back to the kind of show they want from him.
If he wanted to do a really edgy show with lots of sex, why was he on FOX at all? They titillate, sure–that’s not the same thing as following through. They looked at what he gave them, and they knew they had a ratings loser–that’s why they backed away, but they still gave him plenty of time, and lots of promotion.
It was a concept very poorly suited to a network primetime show, and frankly, I doubt Whedon’s take on it would have worked on HBO or Showtime.
No excuses–nobody forced him at gunpoint to pitch this concept to FOX, or to pitch it to anybody. He wanted to do a new show, he had a relationship with FOX and with Dushku, and Dushku had a development contract with FOX. He went there because he knew he could sell it there. He isn’t a very adventurous showrunner, when you get right down to it–he works with 20th or Universal, because he’s got friends at both studios. He can’t work without a cheering section. And that limits him horribly.
His approach to the most unconventional subjects is always very conventional and TeeVee101. He makes good use of old cliches, at the very best of times. His characters are always CHARACTERS–they never feel like real people, and they speak a slightly elevated dialect of sitcom-ese, all wisecracks and one-liners.
Firefly was a WORSE show, IMO. Dollhouse at least tried something different. But the fact that he wanted to get basically legitimize prostitution in both shows is–well–kinda creepy. Yes, he’s saying, the Dollhouse is wrong, but it COULD be made right. No it couldn’t, Joss. And you way miscalculated when you tried to make us like these scummy people who belong in jail. David Chase managed that trick, sure–but he never tried to sugarcoat what his gangsters really were, and he showed them warts and all. Nobody on your shows is allowed so much as a pimple.
IIRC, Fox suggested Inara’s character on Firefly- it wasn’t Joss’s idea.
@pete5125
I saw the original pilot as well, and found it far superior to the mess the actually broadcast
@pisher “If he wanted to do a really edgy show with lots of sex, ”
He didn’t.
The problem with the show wasn’t Fox. It was that the show’s lead was terribly uninteresting. Too much focus was put on the lead. The show was at it’s best when it focused on the supporting characters.
I am a big Whedon fan (Buffy/Angle/Firefly, even DR Horrible) but Dollhouse was dreadful.
What Whedon does best is write good characters, good group chemistry, good character development.
All of that is completely out the window when you main character is a puppet that gets a new personality overlay each week. Terrible concept if you want people to get invested in the character.
Eventually we get some personality bleed through, but it is far too little and far too late. Dushku’s Echo was also just plain annoying.
Good riddance to bad ideas.